GayFatherhood

Since no one has posted in this forum just yet, I thought I'd get the discussions going with this article that I had posted some time ago on our old MSN site. I felt that she had some very good things to say.

Thoughts on a Father’s Coming Out to His Children

by Amity Pierce Buxton, PhD, author of The Other Side of the Closet

How and when does a father come out to his child or children? The answer depends so much on the particular father, his children, and their heterosexual mother -- not to mention in-laws, playmates, neighbors, classmates, church or temple congregation, and community. Not one answer fits all dads or all children. However, some general thoughts from my research, including interviews with children, might help a gay father decide the best way to come out to his children.

From the children's point of view, the task which challenges them most is simply growing up. To cope with each stage of development, they need and want a supportive and stable family environment in which to grow physically, cognitively, psychologically, morally, and socially. They want to know their parents love them and care enough to spend time with them, to let them explore the world around them as well as set limits, and to be there when they get hurt or fail to meet expectations. When things get rough "out there", they want to be able to "come home" to their safety net. Finding out this new information about their father shakes up their picture of the family and adds another challenge with which to cope alongside those of growing up.

Prior to telling his children, a husband's disclosure to his wife has already changed the family constellation in a small or large way, no matter how loving and close the couple are. Whether the wife quietly tries to understand her husband's new identity or erupts in anger, some degree of tension reverberates in the household. Children, closely tuned into the family ethos, often become aware that something is different even before they are told.

The question then is when to come out to them and how. The bottom line is to tell the children with love with a goal of helping them understand, more than of fulfilling the father's need to tell. A relaxed, intimate atmosphere, freed of household chores, perhaps in a setting away from the house, helps create the kind of intimate framework that will best convey a loving and caring meaning of the disclosure. A simple introduction and then a statement with room for reactions and reflection are really all that is needed. Some fathers tell the children separately or all of them at once -- with or without their wives -- in person or in a letter followed up by a face-to-face conversation. Telephone calls have not proved to be effective.

Looking back, children say the sooner they are told the better, or they feel they were not trusted to handle the truth. A rule of thumb that seems to work is to wait until both parents are comfortable enough with the gayness to be able to support their children as they process the disclosure. If the couple plans to separate, it is not helpful to come out at the same time. The break- up poses a worse crisis for the children than the coming out, though both events are upsetting. Coming out some time before or after the divorce will also help the children understand a reason for the break-up other than their being its cause. Despite planned timing, some children, having observed changes in the father's appearance or social activities, precipitate the disclosure. Seeing the father's new partner may also lead to direct questioning. No matter when the father tells the children, the mother's explicit respect of his perspective makes it easier for children to accept the disclosure.

Each age brings its particular reactions and expressed needs. Young children, not knowing much about sexuality much less homosexuality, take the announcement as a matter of fact, as long as they are assured that both parents continue to love them and will be there for them. Older, school-age children may fear taunts from classmates. Teenagers, who do not want to appear different from peers and whose own sexuality is emerging, have the hardest time accepting the news. They face many of the same challenges their gay father faced in his coming out: identity, integrity, sexuality, and life plan. Even children who were told when they were young have to process the information all over again when they become adolescents. Some wonder if they might be gay, lesbian, or bisexual. Others wonder if they, too, might marry someone who will turn out to be gay. Adult children tend to make moral judgments, and some feel angry at the impact on their mother.

No matter at what age children are told, the telling is only the first step. It helps when parents have factual information about homosexuality and resources available as they ask further questions in keeping with their age and stage of development. For instance, teenagers may want to know other teens with gay or lesbian parents, and you can refer them to COLAGE, Children of Lesbians and Gays Everywhere.

The children's first reactions, whether explosive or quiet, generally change over time. Youngsters who are angry at first, eventually figure out that the coming out did not change their father. Others take the news quietly and then leave the room to cry in their own rooms. Some fathers report that their children had no problem with the coming out, based on their not saying anything negative at the time. Apparent acceptance, however, does not mean they have no concerns. Their prior picture of gender, of marriage, of their dad, now needs adjusting. Like any change, this unexpected event is unsettling. As they sort out the incongruity of their father's being gay, questions keep coming. Hopefully, the children feel free to ask them. Some do not, fearing that any expressed negativity will alienate their father.

What are some of these concerns? Some children say they are embarrassed by any changes in their gay parent's appearance, dress, or interactions with gay friends or a partner. Many fear their father will be infected by the AIDS virus. Most feel hurt by anti-gay attitudes expressed by friends, neighbors, classmates, or church and temple congregations -- and rejected by teasing about having a gay dad.

When children are encouraged to talk about such worries, the hurtful events become a source of learning as the gay father and straight mother explain that name-calling stems from ignorance. Parents can also give children tools to handle future problems. For example, if a child were ridiculed at school for having a gay dad, they can suggest retorts such as, "Hey, you're talking about my dad," or "He's still the same old dad, you know".

Keeping children's possible reactions in mind, a gay father can come out to his children with honesty and love, confident that they will at some point accept him in his new identity. This means assuring the children that his relationship with them will not change, that he and their mother both love them, that they will lose neither parent because of this, and that both parents are there to answer questions and help them deal with whatever concerns come up.

Some children take months to accept the disclosure. If for example, the father leaves the household to live alone or with a partner, one or more children may be reluctant to visit him. Advice offered by many fathers includes: Give the children time. Let them ask all the questions they want. Introduce them to changes in your life slowly, one by one. Avoid putting them in situations beyond the sensitivity level of a particular child or the general maturity limitations of this or that age group. Listen to their anger, tears, and accusations without putting up walls to defend yourself. Wipe their tears and cry with them. Show you understand their anger. Explain with confidence your new identity; don't argue.

Coming out requires time, patience, and love. Most children take the news in their stride, if allowed to come to terms with it on their own terms. Being a good parent doesn't stop with coming out. In some cases, the communication initiated by the coming out improves the parent-child bond. Throughout the process, their love for their father remains very much alive, even if not shown. Coming out to them gently and honestly gains their respect.

I think we have often concluded here on GF.com that; the sooner the better is more likely to present less long term issues for all concerned,we need to remember very importantly that it is about the kids....not the father when telling them, that sure having their mum onboard is a huge bonus....AND that honesty and integrity will in the long run prove to be so very important to the kids as they grow up....and the Dad, it's something of a two way street!!!

Thanks for posting this David! It is exactly what is going on in my mind!

So, is there ever a circumstance where not telling them is the answer?

I'm out only to a very few people....not the kids, not their mother, not my family, not the majority of my friends. I'm still living the dual life in some regards, however, they are starting to blend a bit. I've rationalized my not telling as it's really none of their business, so why make an issue out of it?

My BF and I, though we do not live together, have been together for 5 years. He is a huge part of my family and I his. However, we are not out to either side. I'm sure people suspect, however we haven't felt the need to confirm our relationship to anyone. I'm sure this comes from both of us coming from very large, rural, Catholic families. Maybe it's the fear of losing the family that we have. I know that one of my fears is that I may lose custody of the kids because of it (I recently had a visit by the local Social Service folks. There was a report that I was gay and raising 3 kids in 'that environment'. After 5 hours of them combing the house for god-knows-what, they left and I haven't heard anything more about it. The ironic part was that the investigator was a former girlfriend. sheesh!).

When I boil it down, my concern is about the kids. Do they really need to know? At any age? Of course, if they would ask me, I would tell them, but, do I really need to offer up this information?

What am I missing? Have I somehow convinced myself that not telling is right for me and I am actually setting myself up for a fall later in life? I believe that coming out is a very personal decision and people do it for a variety of reasons. I can see most all of the reasons being pesonal. I have a hard time coming up with a reason to tell my kids 'for their sake'.

I've been wrestling with coming out for years. I'm very interested in reading your opinions.

"I don't think so, Tim...."

But seriously , Tim, I think that you will feel better that everyone knows you for all that you are. You are special in their lives and they deserve to know the real you.

As I posted previously, I have a friend who was out to his wife, seperated and she outed him to his kids and in the last 6 months since that has happened, the kids have had nothing to do with him. She has distorted their reality of him. Both are from strong Catholic backgrounds, as am I)

I know its hard to do, but even though it really is "none of their business", being honest is what will count in the end.

Being truthful to all will gather you respect. But yes, you may cause friction, but they will eventually come around.

In my specific situation, I came out to my wife, then my parents. My wife outed me to her family. She did ask me first...

Now I am faced with coming out to the most important person in my life, yes, even more important than my partner, my son. As soon as my ex and I agree on a time, we will do it.

As with you, my partner doesn't live with me,so I could keep up the charade that I live alone, hiding pictures and such. I don't intend to do that anymore... regardless of who comes to visit.

Perhaps, as with you... all my family, including my ex suspect that I have a lover, that may be enough, rather than having had to deliver a double whammy to them. (Everyone in my life save for my son, know I am gay, tho')

I dunno. Now I am ramblin, Tim....

Anyways, that is what I think...

Hi Tim,

This is never an easy one and I guess every situation needs to be looked at from the point of view of the lives you have now...what you want in the future...AND what happens if they, who ever!! find out and tell your kids/family etc.

The fact is that as your kids grow up you will want them to trust you, be open and honest with you, feel able to share the things in their lives that are important and with which they may need your help/advice. How will they react whenever they do know...and surely in the end it will happen if your relastionship of five years is to continue and mean anything? Will they feel lied to, betrayed, bemused that you could lead this double life, love someone and yet not feel that important enough or them for that matter to know this.

We often fear that we will loose more than it is worth, but if you are gay, love the man who you say is a huge part of your family then in the long run where is the honesty and integrity in the relationship with him or any of the people you love and care for. Life is way too short for all of us not to have this measure of happiness and true love.

You mention social services and their search...well some one is saying some thing and if you are 'found out' in the end what will that tell the authorities about you...your life...etc etc. It isn't easy and we have to be brave and pick our timing carefully...better that than have the choice taken cruelly and beyond our control from us.

Cheerio for now...Vincent...x

Thanks for your opinions. I really appreciate them they give me much to think about.

This biggest "pro" that I see in coming out is just what was mentioned, being honest with the kids. I have a wonderful relationship with them and have built that on honesty and letting them know, within reason, what is going on around them. Through the divorce, I was quite open in sharing what was happening less the details that really was not appropriate to share. (you know...instead of "Mom is a broom-riding witch", I said that, "We are having some problems now and I cannot share the details with you. Just know that we both love you very much"). Similarly, they are close with my BF and we are all together frequently (vacations, holidays, weekends, etc). They see how we are together and are aware that we are extremely close. Do they really need to know the full extent of our relationship? I don't think so. Yet...

As for the rest of the family and friends, I'm sure that there would be some who would stand by me and be accepting, others that I would lose, and probably most would be somewhere in between. Honestly, very minor issue to me. My biggest fear is losing my kids. Do I run the risk at this point and come out? Thus far, my opinion is that the risk isn't woth the benefit, so I remain closeted.

As for the visit by social services, I'm not quite sure what they were expecting to find. I don't know too many people, whether they are gay or not, have children or not, that would have inappropriate materials lying around their homes in plain sight of anyone waltzing on through! My therory is that you never know when Aunt Tillie is going make good on the threat of stopping by for the cup of Earl Grey! My biggest problem with the visit is that someone called it in, and the community feels that men, cannot be good parents. I fight that with family and friends, I fought it in court, and now the social service folks are in it.

I know the day is coming that I will need to come out. At some point, I will want to retire as will my BF, and we will then share a winter home in Florida (play cards at the senior center, and search for the ultimate early-bird special, and drive each other crazy full time)! That day is closer than I think! I think that the kids already know. I really believe that they'd be cool with it. So what am I waiting for, you might ask? Good question!

Just looking at my previous post. The "I don't think so, Tim..." was a quote from Al from Home Improvement. Hope that you did not take it the wrong way, Tim.

Take it the wrong way? Of course not. Truth be known? I've never seen Home Improvement, however, I hear that quote all of the time! The first time I heard it I was a little set back but I'm used to it now! Too funny...

Good discussion, fellas...

Well, there is a lot that could be said here but I have to go to work soon and won't be able to be online much this weekend, so I'll have to come back to this. That's okay, it's worth much thought.

I also have saved a few old posts from the msn group that touch on these issues, one of them I have posted here.

Off the top of my head though, a couple of things come to mind. Example; it hit me that my own honesty and integrity would be an example to my own children as they grew up. And if I had the courage to be myself and share that with them, perhaps they would feel more at ease with accepting others and even their own selves. As my son said, "Everybody's different." I felt I needed to model that tolerance in my own life for them, and several years later, I can say that I am glad that I did. They are very good kids, open minded and accepting others who are different from them.

The future. How would it be, I thought, if they found out I was gay from some other source? Their grandparents were not supportive and I had fears early on about their mother keeping them from me. This was touchy ground and took time, but ultimately I wanted them to hear it from me so that they did not feel betrayed or untrusted.

My friend Eric. Sigh... I posted more of his story on msn and I'll dig that up. But, he still has no respect for his father. Why? Well, at the tender age of 10 or 12, in a religious family here in central PA, Eric realized he liked boys. He was that awful word, GAY. His parents were fighting and by the time he was 14 his father had moved out, but he never knew the heart of the issue until many years later.

It wasn't until 18 that he found out his father was aslo gay. Now, I know that every situation has it's unique issues, but think about that. A boy suffering with the guilt and questions alone, when all along his father had the same difficulties and could have been at least an example of courage and love, if not an actually helper and friend to him. In his father's need to hide, he failed to be there for his son in a way Eric needed most.

I didn't want to repeat such a history with one of my sons, didn't even want to risk it. I'm not saying it was easy. But it is better.

Honestly, the phrase "It's none of their business" just makes no sense to me at all. How would you feel if your son started dating but didn't want to tell you about the girl, because "frankly, it's none of Dad's business?"

It is for their sake. If they grow up and find out and end up feeling that they never really knew you... is that worth the risk? For your sake but most importantly for theirs, kids need to know their fathers. We are an example for them in more ways than we can see.

Those are just some of my thoughts this morning. Please pardon any grammar or typos, I must dash! ---- ;-)

Been there it seems,
Yours,
David

David,

Thank you. I'm amazed how much I have conditioned myself over the past 30+ to rationalize my dual life. I've convinced myself that one really doesn't need to blend with the other, to the point that I completely avoided having to put it through my standard litmus test: Would I ever advise my kids to do this? Would I ever tell them to lead a dual life? Of course not! So why do I do it myself? GOOD QUESTION!

I wish you could see me now. I turned so red from embarassment, and have been squirming in my chair because I cannot believe I actually missed this one! UGH!

Your friend's story is a sad one, and I've played out the scenario a couple of ways in my mind. What would I do if my young son came to me and told me he was gay? And, what would my dad do if I was to tell him I was gay back whe I was 14ish? Quite different stories!

I know that I would be supportive of my son, and come out to him then and there. I would be ashamed that I didn't have the courage to come out to him first, and I'd be proud that I had a relationship with him that he felt comfortable and safe enough to tell me. My family was having this discussion one Sunday afternoon. The question was, "What would you do if your child told you he/she was gay"? The answers varied from excommunicating him from the family, to major counselling, to completely ignore that they had said it, to what I said above. My family couldn't believe that anyone would think my way. I was on my soapbox for about 2 minutes and then I realized that I was fighting a losing battle. I didn't back down mind you, but agreed to disagree.

With you telling your son, what was the down side for you? Was there a downside? He's always taken it in stride? Never an issue with it? You mentioned "One of your sons".... If I looked back I could probably figure it out but, you have more than one? what ages? what ages were they when you came out to them? Did they all handle it well? I probably should have started with this.... I know none of this is my business and if I'm going somewhere I have no business going, please tell me.

Good questions, and no, no worries. You haven't asked anything that I haven't been glad to talk about many times on GF in the past.

It's late and it's been a long weekend at work so this might take a couple of posts to answer. I'll try to give the abridged version. lol

Downside? Well, I can't think of one yet. I don't think we've had any issues that were any harder for them to deal with than the regular, and bigger issue of "Mom and Dad are getting a divorce." There may be some religious questions at some point because of their mother's church, but I've already explained to them my view on questions of faith and homosexuality.

I have three sons and the one I was refering to will be 15 next month. I came out to him when he was nine and thus far he has appeared to have no difficulty with it. As a matter of fact we've had some pretty good discussions on the issue. Some of that would be good for a longer post later.

The second boy is 12, and at nine he asked me why Brian and I slept in the same bed. I was sure that his mother had already told him, but he was looking to hear it from me. So I said, "Oh, hun, I thought you knew. Brian is my boy friend." He just smiled this big, quirky smile and said, "REALLY?"

I said, "Yes, does that bother you?"

He smiled and said, "No, it's just weird."

I laughed and replied that if normal was what "most people" did, then maybe it wasn't normal, but that for Brian and I it was perfectly natural. He's been just as okay with it, and even likes to joke with me about it because he knows he can. Like when someone asked him if I voted for Bush, he said, "DUH, he's ga-ay!" lol

And little Micah, well, he's nine now too, and no, I didn't plan nine to be some magical number, but he has grown up with it for all these years, from the first time he accidentally flushed one of Brian's diamond ear rings down the toilet (another nice post to make!) and it seems that he's mostly growing up with it as part of life. He has also sat in on many of the discussions that his older brothers and I have had about my sexuality.

As with any of them, they know that I'd be glad to discuss any of this with them at any time.

Basically, it has been my experience and it seems most logical, that given half a chance, kids adapt to different ideas so much better than adults or teen agers do.

more later, nite

OK just a quickie on this

When we split up we agreed not to tell my son the real reason but wait until he seemed ready. I also was determined to live my life openly and honestly (but not rub any ones face in it so to speak). So my son saw me with my b/f, went on holidays with us and when he was ready, after a year or so asked me if I was gay.

Now the good thing was he had seen me all the time before and after the divorce/coming out etc and saw no difference other than how happy I was. I continued as a very active positive father in his life, he knew he was and always would be thee priority in my life. So when he asked me if I was gay and David my b/f, and the question was prefaced by telling me how much he loved me, what a great Dad I was and it didn't matter what the answer was, it was easy to answer. Ok not without some embarrassment, because it is odd talking to your son about your own sexuality and what that means etc and giving them the chance to question you about that adult issue.....but what a fantastic feeling to have it happen in that way. My boy is straight as any young guy I know....sure in a way I could wish he was gay but he isn't. Yet now he lives week about with me and knows an loves and is loved by all my gay friends. H e has adapted to the situation in a way that is a credit to his maturity as a human being....and his love for me ...and I never forget it.

Vincent..xox

Vincent,

That is kind of how I envision coming out.... I live my life as usual, and if asked, I tell. Until then, I haven't felt the need to make the proclaimation. I have gay friends and they are around my family. My BF is here every weekend and the kids know and love him.

I think that my kids suspect, though they haven't come out and asked. I think my siblings have suspected since I was a kid. My friends are starting to ask more questions....hmmmmm....divorced for 5 years and not dating yet....hmmmm...

It sounds like you have a special relationship with your son. Isn't it amazing? There is nothing like the unconditional love of a child. You are blessed!

It is probably important to note the differences in each of our situations. Vincent and his former wife agreed to tell when they felt their son was ready. I had a similar agreement with Gin, though I admit to being worried at her emotional state. Would she change her mind and sit down with materials from Exodus International or some other anti-gay thing to help him pray for his father's soul? That was a stretch, but it's hard to underestimate the wild thoughts or actions of a woman who is hurting.

Your wife, Tim, has apparently no idea, and this may be why you are worried about loosing the kids. Though, I don't think that legally in any state in the US you could be denied even partial custody for being gay. Your biggest danger may or may not be your wife. It may be whoever made that call to social services. Someone knows or is suspecting. And that someone will spread rumors, probably already is. I'm not trying to be alarmist, just pointing out the way it usually goes with human nature.

In my situation I had more obstacles than Vincent when it comes to the dangers of passionately followed religion. The whole of Virginia's family and about half of mine were predisposed against homosexuality as some kind of sin or sickness. Her parents were angry with me for hurting their little girl (and who can blame them for that?).

My thinking was that they needed to hear it from me before they heard it from a hostile source (no matter how well-intentioned the Christians may have felt they were). I couldn't bare to think of them alone in their rooms at night privately trying to process the awful information given to them. "Is Daddy gay? Will Daddy go to Hell?" I wanted to assure them before we got to that point. Would there be questions later? Of course, but better to have them preceeded by my loving assurance.

How old are your kids? And who might they hear about this from? A gossip spreading relative? An angry hurt mother? Might she have heard things about you and suspect? There are a lot of things to consider here when deciding what is best for the kids, and only you know the answers to these questions.

I only contend that the statement "it's none of their business" sounds like a loving but frightened father fooling himself into an easy answer. You are their father and you are their business. How the particulars of your situation lead you toward your answer, only you can decide. Our examples (even my friend Eric's) can be helpful, but only as far as they apply to your situation. Whatever you do, don't let yourself rationalize.

From what you've said, I don't think you will. You're obviously in deep thought about this already.

Best wishes and warm thoughts.
Your friend,
David